Curse

Zinger314 · Aug 08, 2006, 06:00 AM // 06:00

I don't PvP because I don't have a guild, which means I can't GvG, AB, or rarely HA.

I could do RA and competitive missions, but those are too easy for me.

Andy_M · Aug 08, 2006, 06:56 AM // 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metanoia

Interesting conclusion, considering that almost every post in this thread was made by someone that plays either PvE or BOTH. I'm sure everyone who's read your original post in this topic is well aware of your perfectly rational distain for the PvP community, there's no need to re-affirm it every other page.

Ps.

Oh please, don't be such a overreacting drama queen.

'
Because I'd rather have my own build than have to use a cookie-cutter to get a pvp match. And to be honest, if I want to pvp, then I would rather shoot someone in the face with a gun. And believe it or not the pvp community makes the counterstrike one look well-mannered and respectful.'

If that is the original post you are referring to then if you want to break it down a little bit you get this. I criticized the fact that you generally need a cookie cutter build to get in a group in the first place. Then I stated my preference for counterstrike pvp. And finally I mentioned that the pvp community in this game is not the best. Where exactly did I show disdain(I assume that's what you meant) for the community ? One of the major themes of this thread was the fact that people don't pvp BECAUSE of the community. You have read the thread ? I doubt it since you are convinced I post every other page.

'Never the twain shall meet' - pretty accurate I would say. And there HAS been a fair amount of preaching, don't see how you can have a go for light-heartedly mentioning the truth.

So in conclusion, choose to 'pick' at my posts if you wish, really doesn't matter when you do it so badly.

ps

dreamhunk · Aug 08, 2006, 07:02 AM // 07:02

I don't pvp because i don't find it too fun. I like epic battles with mounts and stuff.

in fps the are cars and planes that are soo much fun, I think that is the best part about fps

*lemming* · Aug 08, 2006, 07:32 AM // 07:32

I picked one of the few coherent posts from a PvEer (well, anyone) to reply to.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myria

5) I like being called a 'scrub' -- a term PVPers seem to like hurling around almost as much as 'noob' -- because I PVE. I'm not entirely sure what is meant by 'scrub', but I figure that cleanliness is next to godliness, scrubbing leads to cleanliness, thus being a 'scrub' must mean one is godly. Not that I particularly aspire to goddesshood, mind you, but it does seem clear that 'scrub' is a high compliment indeed.

Scrub = someone who refuses to run a "cookie-cutter" build.

So if you play B/P or an SS necro in PvE, you don't exactly qualify for scrubdom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myria

3) I prefer a challenge. In PVP everyone's the same level, everyone has the same health, everyone has the same armor, everyone has the same skills... Boring! No challenge at all! Now go fight Rotscale. He's ten levels higher than you, has roughly 20 times your health, has essentially infinite energy, his skills do several multiples of the amount of damage yours can, your hexes only last half as long on him, and he casts twice as fast as you. Throw in all of his buddies and random poison spots and it's enough to give any sane person nightmares. I dunno about you, but in my book fighting Rotty is much more of a challenge than fighting your average wammo who's primary skill is the ability to type 'noob' quickly and often.

To me, the challenge there is completely different from the one found in PvP.

In PvE, the AI is, quite frankly, crap. The only way to make bad AI difficult is to increase the base stats of the enemy you're fighting.

In PvP, the challenge doesn't come from beefed-up stats, it's from an enemy who will adapt to whatever you're doing to kill him.

(This post does not pertain to RA or HA, so no idiot Wammos. The enemy I'm talking about here is, ideally, one with actual skill.)

I'm not saying that PvE's challenges are unfun, just that they're difficult to compare.

=HT=Ingram · Aug 08, 2006, 07:53 AM // 07:53

in all honesty I don't enjoy it. it has little raw benifit beyond bragging rights. and quite frankly I am not a vain teeny bopper anymore. I just don't give a shit. I just want to play. The Rankest and such ahs drastically reduced yes. I'll give them that... but just like this last PvP event. everyone was bitching that the new builds were over powered instead of playing around and finding ways to beat them. Thats seems to be the biggest issue to me. The prerequisite of cookie cutter builds to be included in a party. Every try to join a group as a smitting monk? lol You will be kicked in a heart beat. Or a Blood necro that likes wells instead of being only a battery? And don't even get me started on Rangers and mesmers when they are not the restrictive cookie cutter builds...

I like to play the game and try new stuff. and most parties don't want that at all. they all want the same old stuff everyone else does... Thing I enjoy is when I find a total FU build to stuff like Iway, or BP builds... So I tend to just stick to PvE Elite missions and bonus UW and Fissure missions. Unless I'm helping a guildie or ally I should say.

PS: Anet we got all these other shrines... when we going to get something new with them? I would love to see another bonus UW like area in ToA for Nightfall!!!! Like the long talked about Lyssa's Realm Bonus Mission.

Winstar · Aug 08, 2006, 08:39 AM // 08:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexus Icon

Nice try, but there's no point trying to convince me otherwise.
I come from a competetive RtCW background where we ranked highly in the European ladder, and compared to that, competetive RPGs are farcical.

Hell, I knew my comment would stir up the aggressive PvP crowd, and it just serves to further my disgust with your inability to take criticism.

Oh, and your whole argument regarding builds falls apart completely as soon as you meet the opposition, as there is no way whatsoever to know what build the opposition are running.

If you want me to take you seriously, petition ANet for set build PvP, where teams have identical classes with identical skillsets and equipment.

Now THAT would be a true test of who could hit the right sequence of numbers fast enough... er, I mean "skill".

First, diversity in builds doesn't in anyway undermine skill. In any given match you can be pretty certain that you know you'll be facing one of a number of possible builds from the metagame. Your team has to able to anticpate the possbilities and make effective choices for your skill bar and have a plan of action for how you are going to react once you see what you are up against. The situation of a metagame is pretty much analogous to Magic the Gathering. Skill in guildwars PvP is not merely button spamming, and thats what is important. To equate skill solely with reflex is simply a far too narrow a view of skill. You seem to be comparing 2 very different games which diverge in their skill requirements, and claiming that one kind of skill is not really skill which doesn't make any sense. Beyond video games, its the same in sports. Teams aren't given identical pieces to work with. Teams all utilize different strategies. They have different players on their rosters with differnt skills. Thank the God's its not mere button spamming or i'd have deleted the bloody game months ago. I'm not sure why you think equipment has anything to do with this considering you can roll pvp characters with pretty much anything you want. There is imbalance for a new player stepping into RA with no runes or mods unlocked, but at the competative level this is a non-issue.

Also, its one thing to be critical and present arguments. But how you present them is important as well. You can present an argument without being a jerk. If you want people to listen, and if you actually care about a reasonable dialouge its generally better to not aim to piss people off from the start.
-----------------------------------

HT Ingram

About the value of PvP- its more than simple bragging rights. Its loads of fun to do. The actual grind of PvE after one has done the missions isn't that enjoyable in itself for for me. I don't really like farming as I find it dull and repetative but its the shiny loot that keeps me at it now and again. I see PvP as the reverse. Its not the end that keeps me going but the actual playing. Rank in HA and ladder standings are alright, but I don't play GvG or HA because I want loads of fame or to be at the top of the ladder (not primarily- though in terms of GvG i admit I like improving and winning) I play because I love the matches. I have fun, its challenging and I continue to develop as a player.

Also, I would bet a million dollars that more smiters are in PvP groups than PvE ones

. Monks in PvE are like rare treasures, people get pissed off when they think that after hours of spamming in a district they finally have a monk to heal them and they turn out to smite.

Metanoia · Aug 08, 2006, 10:40 AM // 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy_M

...[snip]... ps

I feel... violated.

Anyway...
"I criticized the fact that you generally need a cookie cutter build to get in a group in the first place."
This really isn't a problem outside of PUGs. I'm sure you're aware that this is mirrored in PvE PUGs, too.

"Where exactly did I show disdain for the community?"
("And believe it or not the pvp community makes the counterstrike one look well-mannered and respectful")
That's probably the part that put that notion in my head. Maybe you weren't refering to the cliche Counter-strike community but a subsect that parlays over tea mid-game.

"One of the major themes of this thread was the fact that people don't pvp BECAUSE of the community."
Yes, there are a lot of obtuse comments being thrown around, I agree.
Note: People like Gli, dispite having a somewhat double-standard when it comes to FotMs, I can understand. Some people just don't find PvP fun by it's very nature, I can respect that. People that, after playing a match in RA, go on to rant about the state of PvP as a whole on the other hand...

Ps.

(TM)

JR · Aug 08, 2006, 12:20 PM // 12:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by tehlemming

Scrub = someone who refuses to run a "cookie-cutter" build.

More generally used to simply refer to a bad player who doesn't particularly care about improving.

Caged Fury · Aug 08, 2006, 12:43 PM // 12:43

At the moment, the only kind of PvP that I do is Fort Aspenwood - I play on either the Luxon or Kurzick side depending on my mood. Sometimes the PvE side of GW bores me because some the mobs consist of the same professions, who has the same skills and does the same thing over and over again. They provide a challenge at first, but once you have worked out their skills and patterns you can easily steamroll them. RA, TA, etc doesn't interest me at the moment since I mainly PvE. However, Fort Aspenwood and the likes, do entertain me because it has elements of both PvE and PvP.

These maps are like most PvE missions with PvP thrown in. You have an objective and fight NPCs with some human opponents thrown in, who provide a surprising, additional challenge.

When I first entered Fort Aspenwood, I was a bit scared having to go against other players as I saw it as PvP and read many of the name-calling/flaming stories on this site that happens in PvP. PvE builds that saw my characters through GW:P and most of GW:F with ease didn't really worked and I was killed time and time again. I had to change my gameplay and try out different builds.

My worries were unfounded and grew to enjoy these maps. I can play any of my characters that I choose and it doesn't really matter to someone else what I play. I can play any build that I chose and it doesn't really matter to anyone else. I can focus on the PvE side, and avoid encountering other human players and treat it like any other PvE missions. I can go against other human players and see if I'm really as good as I think I am. With a good team there is communication and teamwork. Good, friendly, polite players seem to outnumber the jerks. I've seen more "Hi", "GL", "HF" and "GG" here than in normal PvE missions. Opponents have even praised me for doing a good job.

If you're a PvEr and want to experience some PvP, then I would suggest trying Fort Aspenwood rather than RA - it has elements from both worlds..

Duly Thankful · Aug 08, 2006, 12:51 PM // 12:51

A 'bad player'? By who's definition? I tried GvG and a couple of other forms of PvP and didn't like any of them. I certainly don't care about improving my gameplay in something I dislike, so if that makes me a 'bad player' it is only in your opinion. Generalisations are what causes most of the bad feelings on here.

If you like PvP - fine! Have fun with it! Seriously, I mean it - it's a game and thats exactly what you should be doing. Just don't try and classify those that (in my opinion..!) are the biggest section of the GW community as bad players. I would champion the right of anybody on here to enjoy whatever aspect of GW they like, as long as it is within the rules that Anet lay down for the game.

Metanoia · Aug 08, 2006, 01:41 PM // 13:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duly Thankful

A 'bad player'? By who's definition? ...[snip]...

The person throwing the insult, of course. Which is why it holds about as much weight as 'noob'.
Ironically, 'scrub' is usually reserved for insulting players running 'gimmicky' builds.

Ps.

(TM)

Inde · Aug 08, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

This thread is now closed for insults and becoming just another PvP vs. PvE arguement. It started off well but has deteriorated.